The Current State of Weapons

[Crimson-Artist]

Hey guys, I will be working on an article for Starfeed and would like everyones honest opinions on the current state of weapons in the game.

Things to consider

• What works and what doesn't/needs work?
• Where balance is needed? in what form?
• Weapon Combos
• Player weapons
• Support systems (power/shield transfer, ect.)
• Effects
• Ideas for new weapons
• Tactics (attack and defense)
• Logic

Thanks, guys

 

[Keptick]

The shotgun pattern really needs to be randomized. As it stands it's completely unusable because 70% of the projectiles end up on the far right, and making a proper shotgun array (that puts flak EVERYWHERE) just isn't possible, sadly...

Apart from that, I would maybe suggest removing lock-on from the missile-pulse combo since the point of siege weapons is high risk (of missing) high reward (if it hits), this stands for siege beams and cannons but is nonexistent for missiles (a fairly big advantage imho since it mostly negates the downsides of the weapon).

 

[Zeno9141]

ALL of the player weapons and armor! Seriously, I want variety. The player part of this game needs an upgrade. (Oh, and also the fact the place you look from is not in Dave's head but in his chest bothers me a lot)

 

[Crimson-Artist]

ALL of the player weapons and armor! Seriously, I want variety. The player part of this game needs an upgrade. (Oh, and also the fact the place you look from is not in Dave's head but in his chest bothers me a lot)

care to be more specific on the player weapons? is there anything about the current set you would change/adjust?

 

[Criss]

I dislike the shotgun weapons overall. Swarm missiles are fine, even if they are heat seeking only. But shotgun lasers? I wouldn't mind if they were a bit more focused. I think it honestly looks so dumb when they are fired. It just doesn't feel right to me. Looks like a mess and feels like there is no real structure to it. I feel like it brings little to the game in a way. Why would I bother spreading my weapons capabilities out over a dozen or more less powerful shots? I would have to be close for those to all count.

 

[MrFURB]

I agree with Keptick in that the majority of missiles having lock-on capabilities negates most of the disadvantages that were originally in place to make up for the missile's inherent AOE. The destructible missiles in the dev builds and videos could even this out, but it could also be a bit overbearing of a solution... Especially when applied to the already lackluster dumb fire missiles. We'll have to wait and see how well point defenses perform.

And let's not forget that fixing damage pulse primary weapons is also a priority. There's an entire quarter of the weapon system that isn't being used at all!

 

[jayman38]

I feel that weapons in general should have a quicker reload and lower damage (to maintain dps) as standalone systems. Not by too much, maybe drop from an average 3s reload to 1 or 2. As it is, I feel like I need at least 50% cannon slaves on absolutely everything in order to have a decent reload rate, which eliminates the use of any other slave weapon system, so my weapons aren't as specialized or as effective as I'd like. On the other hand, having weapon combos that increase damage should increase damage by even more and make the reload time longer (maintaining dps), all to keep the "epic" feel of the combo.

I also feel that beams should have a range of 80% that of cannons instead of 50%. (800 m) A range of 500 m just seems too nerfy, even for an instant hitscan weapon.

I'd also like to see slaved single-weapon computers that can be slaved to a weapon system that (similar to light blocks) can be linked up to give the "look" of the weapon. For example, you slave a solitary cannon computer to a weapon system, to make the weapon system fire small "bullets". Or slave a solitary beam computer to a weapon system to make the weapon system fire "blasters" (elongated bullets/lasers). Or slave a solitary missile computer to a weapon system to make it fire larger (and maybe slower?) "bullets".

 

[Zeno9141]

care to be more specific on the player weapons? is there anything about the current set you would change/adjust?

Well, first of all, it would be nice if they would appear on the player in non-pistol variants. Because who launches rockets from a peashooter? Current weapon types are fine as they are, except for the pistol. I'd like to see a pistol which is actually a pistol and not some fully automatic rifle. And if more weapon variants are added (I'm thinking shotguns, automatic rifles, hell, maybe even placeable bombs :0 ), they could be made into a slower weapon, with the fast-firing weapon being the rifle.

And what I find lacking most, is ammo. It would make astronaut combat so much more interesting to see.

 

[marcus87]

I would love to have the option for desynchronised shooting for arrays of more than one weapon. For example you have unguided missiles but they all fire at the same time. What I want is a constant stream of missiles, would be cool for cannon turrets too.

And I think the support systems need balancing. For example I was able to install ion effect on my newest ship, but only with 2,5% effect. It just needs way to much power. But at the same time only very few blocks. I would like it the other way around more blocks needed but less power.

 

[Criss]

I feel that weapons in general should have a quicker reload and lower damage (to maintain dps) as standalone systems. Not by too much, maybe drop from an average 3s reload to 1 or 2. As it is, I feel like I need at least 50% cannon slaves on absolutely everything in order to have a decent reload rate, which eliminates the use of any other slave weapon system, so my weapons aren't as specialized or as effective as I'd like. On the other hand, having weapon combos that increase damage should increase damage by even more and make the reload time longer (maintaining dps), all to keep the "epic" feel of the combo.

I also feel that beams should have a range of 80% that of cannons instead of 50%. (800 m) A range of 500 m just seems too nerfy, even for an instant hitscan weapon.

I'd also like to see slaved single-weapon computers that can be slaved to a weapon system that (similar to light blocks) can be linked up to give the "look" of the weapon. For example, you slave a solitary cannon computer to a weapon system, to make the weapon system fire small "bullets". Or slave a solitary beam computer to a weapon system to make the weapon system fire "blasters" (elongated bullets/lasers). Or slave a solitary missile computer to a weapon system to make it fire larger (and maybe slower?) "bullets".

That would raise the damage done by fast firing weapons, bringing them closer to the orininal damage per shot and possibly be a balancing issue on its own. If instead of ten second reloards, a regular cannon shots does 25 dmg in 5 sec reloads. Well in 5 seconds those rapid fire shots need to do the same amount of dmg, whereas before it was 10 seconds. That there just doubled the damage that rapid fire did. This would require a bit of fine tuning to get right.

 

[Jonj57]

I'd like to see a pistol which is actually a pistol and not some fully automatic rifle.

I don't mean to break your heart but there are dozens of fully automatic/burst pistols, including the infamous Glock 18 with it's 1200 RPM fire rate. xP

 

[Crimson-Artist]

I don't mean to break your heart but there are dozens of fully automatic/burst pistols, including the infamous Glock 18 with it's 1200 RPM fire rate. xP

i think he is talking bout in-game pistol mechanics. The fact that machine pistols exist in real life doesn't mean that they should be added in game.

For the sake of balance it would be better to have the pistol become a powerful slow firing semi-auto weapon while a automatic rifle would replace the pistol in its current use

 

[Vengeance42]

In any game when some weapon/defense combos are almost never used, and others are considered default, it is a sign of "imba".

Fast cannons seem to be a default setup for cannons. I think for example, other cannon combos should be ramped up (and perhaps fast cannon nerfed) until enough people use it that fast cannons are only about 1/4 of the cannons people make.

I suspect lots of people put ion defense in their ship. But do they bother with EMP defense? (I think EMP attack is broken but I plan to test a little more today). People should have some cause for concern about leaving themselves vulnerable if they leave the dock without an EMP defense. Not that its mandatory, just concern about the possible hole. The same applies to any of the defensive effects no one uses. And probably ion defense is too overpowering.

I think combinations no one uses should be boosted in effectiveness until they become viable options, bearing in mind that there is ship/base conflict as well as ship/ship conflict.

 

[Criss]

I would personally like to see some sort of target painter. When a ship has a target painter activated and is targeting an enemy ship, its weapon systems or those of nearby allies could get a bit of a damage boost? Not much, but I think the real value would be for missiles. Using a target painter would allow swarm missiles to follow your target, instead of heatseaking. In the case of regular lock on missiles, perhaps they could be nerfed so that there is a chance the lock will fail, and a target painter would be used to ensure a 100% hit chance with the proper ratios. Not sure if I would keep dumbfire the same or not, probably the same. They have a larger impact it seems and giving them a lock on option seems to bypass the other combos completely so maybe they should be unaffected.

 

[Crimson-Artist]

And what I find lacking most, is ammo. It would make astronaut combat so much more interesting to see.

actually adding an astronaut energy meter would be the best compromise

you can preserve the current system of infinite ammo while connecting players with the ship building aspect. Guns could have energy demands that correspond with how they fire.

• Pistols: Powerful slow-firing short range semi-auto weapon=Average drain; short bursts will allow your energy meter to refill but consistent fire will eventually cause an outage, preventing you from attack and/or acting entirely
• Assault rifle: Weak Rapid-fire medium range weapon=low drain;short bursts will allow your energy meter to refill but consistent fire will eventually cause an outage, preventing you from attack and/or acting entirely
• Shotguns: Medium-High powered Slow firing spread weapon=medium drain; every shot could use up to half of your energy meter
• Sniper Rifle: Powerful Slow firing long range weapon=High drain; single shots can cause near outages
• Rocket Launcher: Powerful Slow Firing medium to long range explosive weapon= High drain; single shots can cause near outages

Also giving players an energy meter could open up possibilities for more gadgets and tools to be used *Cough jet packs cough*[DOUBLEPOST=1411579306,1411578883][/DOUBLEPOST]forgot to add that if we had regenerating shields it could add an interesting prospect to combat as energy is needed for shields to regenerate and your guns need energy to fire. it would add a fight-or-flight prospect to fighting.

hopefully that doesn't sound too Halo-like

 

[jayman38]

That would raise the damage done by fast firing weapons, bringing them closer to the orininal damage per shot and possibly be a balancing issue on its own. If instead of ten second reloards, a regular cannon shots does 25 dmg in 5 sec reloads. Well in 5 seconds those rapid fire shots need to do the same amount of dmg, whereas before it was 10 seconds. That there just doubled the damage that rapid fire did. This would require a bit of fine tuning to get right.

Sorry, I'm not following you. Why would shots need to do the same amount of damage in half the time?

With my faster-fire-rate suggestion, a single-block cannon with a dps of 5/s firing at 1s intervals would have a damage output per shot of 5, instead of a damage output of 15 every 3s. (Currently, cannon weapons without a slave fire once every 3 seconds.)

Are you worried about single-block cannons with insignificant damage on each shot? Rapid-fire cannon-slaves would have a similar problem of reduced damage per shot, but typically players use enough blocks so that the damage per shot is significant.

To illustrate: a cannon-cannon slaved system with 1 weapon block for each computer will only have 1 damage per shot. 5dps master + 5dps slave = 10 dps. Divide 10 dps by 10 shots per second, and you have a nice solid 1 damage per shot, for every tenth of a second.)

 

[Crimson-Artist]

I would personally like to see some sort of target painter. When a ship has a target painter activated and is targeting an enemy ship, its weapon systems or those of nearby allies could get a bit of a damage boost? Not much, but I think the real value would be for missiles. Using a target painter would allow swarm missiles to follow your target, instead of heatseaking. In the case of regular lock on missiles, perhaps they could be nerfed so that there is a chance the lock will fail, and a target painter would be used to ensure a 100% hit chance with the proper ratios. Not sure if I would keep dumbfire the same or not, probably the same. They have a larger impact it seems and giving them a lock on option seems to bypass the other combos completely so maybe they should be unaffected.

I've actually thought about target painting however my interpretation would be for merely increasing the overall accuracy of turrets since they now cant hit the broadside of a titan as well as indicating priority targets to surrounding players/fleet AI.

 

[Vengeance42]

I thought AI accuracy was server configurable, something turrets shared with pirates.

 

[Megacrafter127]

I'd have an idea for a new effect there, if you don't mind @Crimson-Artist :

Vektor-effect:

• slaved:
  
  • causes projectiles to only deal a part of their damage to their target, and then bounce of off it.
    • number of bounces should depend on the effect's efficiency and configs.
  • causes beams to also only deal a part of their damage and be reflected by their target.
    • the maximum number of reflections should depend on the effect's efficiency and again, configs
  • adds a direction to pulses. the effect's efficiency determines how big the angle of affection will be
    • might come with a range/RoF increase?
• passive:
  • increases turn rate?
  • reduces damage of bounced/reflected projectiles/beams?
  • reduces the amount of bounces/reflections of projectiles/beams will have after hitting?

 

[ToyotaSupra]

10/10, they're ok. -IGN

I personally would like to see the return of stats but so far I really like the weapons system.