Specialize Planets : bunker, mining and others...

arkahys · Apr 26, 2018

Problems :

there is no really utility to make a station on planets as there is more constraints than interesting aspects.
huge ships docked or close to planets make them ridiculous.
On highly frequented server, there is only magma core of planets on thousands of systems arounds.
I was convinced that was not PC (or server) performance who was actually the limit of salvage rate and I succeed to salvage big asteroids in dozen of seconds on my light config (4go ram, intel HD, duo 3,2 Ghz), the i touch and see the performance limitation, and I'am actually little affraid to talk a bout the technic for High pc config.
That is the starting point to find ideas to balance all of that.

split salvage asteroids and mine planet :

atmosphere disable Salavage beams as a shield, so you can't salvage a planet. It's only an asteroid tool.
Mine on planet take time but is reward and don't empty all blocks. (so you can't come take all blocks and leave in 1 min) :
- You can build mine to harvest ressources plates, but it's an timed process : so you build a mine, a cargo on it and leave it time to get ore and shards.
  Then you have to protect your planets to not be stripped.
- To give a mine aspect such settings could be applied :
  - Actual salvage module could be used on planets as a zone effect thats drain ressources on X blocks around salvage module.
  - Number of blocks of salvage module group above "sea level" determine the rate of ressource drain. 0 blocks above sea level make 0 drain by seconds.
  - the actual integrity base calcul make the multiplier of "drain damage" of each block
  - Use weapons as secondary modify drain area, damages and rate.
- To prevent planet stripping : earth is heavy and no value item and/or better mass is exponential in inventory.

Make planet a good bunker place :

earth (or ground) thickness on planets make a multiplier of armor
destructed blocks replace adjacent block by christalized version of block ( as weapons make fusion )
these blocks are heavily HP and AHP (on planets only). they take many time to be harvested (ho, writing this line, that's make me think about obsidian in others game).
Could force to engage ennemy by feet !

Give Some negative points to huge ship in contact with planets can avoid size comparison by been close and force to use shuttle to settle :

add 2 bubble zone around planets : one little about 100 blocks of planet surface, one big radius (2x planet radius).
If a part of ship touch the little bubble, all blocks of ship who are out of the biggest bubble take damage over time.

Nosajimiki · Apr 26, 2018

Generally you have some interesting ideas here. There have been plenty of suggestions of various forms along similar lines to make planets less strip-minable, and more of control point assets. That said, the devs already have a half built mechanic for much larger, less laggy planets that may indirectly address some of your concerns simply by making them too big to be a quickly stripmined away.

MacThule · Apr 26, 2018

The concerns over planet utility and function are real. This is a huge issue for a lot of players!

There is apparently a massive universe update in the works for whenever they manage to properly stabilize the new weapon & armor balance with the reactor system. We have seen hints of vast, sprawling new planets incoming, and we have been told that there are major changes coming to the whole way resources are distributed throughout the galaxy, including asteroids. So your post is fairly timely, maybe a little early (personally I'm curious to see what they do at this point with the hundreds of planet suggestions out there, as well as how the new planets work).

NuclearFun · Apr 26, 2018

I agree, the only ways planets would be viable in my eyes is with non block mining (mining the core, slow but steady resource flow without horrendous lag) and giving a somewhat safe place to build and explore that can't be insta nuked from space by a fighter sized ship.

MacThule · Apr 26, 2018

NuclearFun said:
I agree, the only ways planets would be viable in my eyes is with non block mining (mining the core, slow but steady resource flow without horrendous lag) and giving a somewhat safe place to build and explore that can't be insta nuked from space by a fighter sized ship.

I have to agree. Since the last major thread on instanced planets, (last I noticed, anyway) I have definitely come around to the idea, though I was strongly against it before. Planets are simply too useless, but could be amazing fun if they weren't basically paper mache balls worth a fortune to whole-mine.

Mining planetary cores over time would be very good and keep them around and mostly intact!

I think that it may be possible to retain planetary destruction, but the difficulty should be increased substantially and the planet's resources should be vaporized so it that it doesn't happen as a standard part of the industrial process and would represent a loss of wealth because there would be one less core to mine, rather than a gain of wealth by creating giant plates to mine. The trouble of balancing it is that it seems almost not worth it though - instancing or placing planet surfaces in a sector only reachable through an atmospheric entry transition could afford a lot of protection to planets, and would not likely be any slower than the current chunk-load time already is.

Sachys · Apr 26, 2018

MacThule said:
paper mache balls worth a fortune to whole-mine.

Planets have been worthless for mining for the last two years since asteroids were updated. Additionally Schine made it highly difficult to blow them up, so they are currently entirely worthless other than as claims (unless anything has changed since the new power was forced upon us).

arkahys · Apr 27, 2018

Nosajimiki said:
Generally you have some interesting ideas here. There have been plenty of suggestions of various forms along similar lines to make planets less strip-minable, and more of control point assets. That said, the devs already have a half built mechanic for much larger, less laggy planets that may indirectly address some of your concerns simply by making them too big to be a quickly stripmined away.

I know that's dev plan to implement huge planets, and I red so many post on planet suggestions , it's an other "to dev attention, on your realease goals, may that is a good idea".
No one red with such suggestions who incite to make building in certain shape (as ship actually). I find this simple ideas very interesting and repercussive...

MacThule said:
The concerns over planet utility and function are real. This is a huge issue for a lot of players!

There is apparently a massive universe update in the works for whenever they manage to properly stabilize the new weapon & armor balance with the reactor system. We have seen hints of vast, sprawling new planets incoming, and we have been told that there are major changes coming to the whole way resources are distributed throughout the galaxy, including asteroids. So your post is fairly timely, maybe a little early (personally I'm curious to see what they do at this point with the hundreds of planet suggestions out there, as well as how the new planets work).

I red too many things about universe update. Very interesting, but... I'm new, and when i see the date of olders posts who talk about universe update, I find this weird, I naturally asking when ?
I quit some WIP games because "SOON" become the bad answers for too many suggestions, because there is a standart explanation to delay : we have to do some stuff before...
Caution I don't blame starmade as I'm new here, but it's what appends with so many WIP i hardly follow, help, betatest, etc...
when players ask for few lines of codes to get big improvement/repercussion, answer "Soon there will be a major update who will ad this x10 000" can do the tricks, but after 1 year, and 1 other year, and 1 other .. etc...
It's legitime to ask yourself a question : spend about 6 hours to code simple "buffer solutions", wouldn't have it be better on very long delay, where work needed is about 3 years, then 1 day is 1/1000 ?

I red some interesting simple idea who I'm asking to me why they don't take the time of a cigarets break to "code that to wait better".

In one word :
In alpha game state, take 1 hour on some little thing could afford a big "enjoy play waiting better" even if that will be rewritted 1 year later.
I post some suggestions who are simple to implement to be in the final game or to wait...

>>> Give armor to heart when grouped (on planet only),
>>> Generate a spread effect on ground destruction who make block not displayed damaged but cristalized (with as simple alpha sprite as damage)
= bunker, huge underground bases, planet preservation, tactics : better way to carefully settle and mine by hand to find the base than fire from bigs ships...

>>> planet can't be salvage
>>> when build block is on planet : salvage module placed auto-salvage ressources on a radius at low rate (this one is the more long to code, but don't think I pass on this more than 1 day and I'm a casual coder)
= no strip planets, more building to do, protect planets and search for others mines, regulary things to do (after all !) un rendez-vous !. many more logical system to exploit auto this extraction... that's give many things with few lines (of codes)....

For Ideas who are quite complex (wth balance, codes etc..) but I don't write because it is effectively early :
Make planet exploding when core is not enough covered by earth (or ground blocks) as volcanoes... destructing all in sector or 4 around, Then you can make trap on planets by explosive in many parts, huge ship will avoid planets during battle in ennemies territories.. could give a big tactical effect...
don't talk about all balance, have to be long to prepare, with a "no salvage planet", etc...
That IS a early idea i keep for me ! lol

Nosajimiki · Apr 27, 2018

arkahys said:
I know that's dev plan to implement huge planets, and I red so many post on planet suggestions , it's an other "to dev attention, on your realease goals, may that is a good idea".
No one red with such suggestions who incite to make building in certain shape (as ship actually). I find this simple ideas very interesting and repercussive...

I red too many things about universe update. Very interesting, but... I'm new, and when i see the date of olders posts who talk about universe update, I find this weird, I naturally asking when ?
I quit some WIP games because "SOON" become the bad answers for too many suggestions, because there is a standart explanation to delay : we have to do some stuff before...
Caution I don't blame starmade as I'm new here, but it's what appends with so many WIP i hardly follow, help, betatest, etc...
when players ask for few lines of codes to get big improvement/repercussion, answer "Soon there will be a major update who will ad this x10 000" can do the tricks, but after 1 year, and 1 other year, and 1 other .. etc...
It's legitime to ask yourself a question : spend about 6 hours to code simple "buffer solutions", wouldn't have it be better on very long delay, where work needed is about 3 years, then 1 day is 1/1000 ?

I red some interesting simple idea who I'm asking to me why they don't take the time of a cigarets break to "code that to wait better".

In one word :
In alpha game state, take 1 hour on some little thing could afford a big "enjoy play waiting better" even if that will be rewritted 1 year later.
I post some suggestions who are simple to implement to be in the final game or to wait...

>>> Give armor to heart when grouped (on planet only),
>>> Generate a spread effect on ground destruction who make block not displayed damaged but cristalized (with as simple alpha sprite as damage)
= bunker, huge underground bases, planet preservation, tactics : better way to carefully settle and mine by hand to find the base than fire from bigs ships...

>>> planet can't be salvage
>>> when build block is on planet : salvage module placed auto-salvage ressources on a radius at low rate (this one is the more long to code, but don't think I pass on this more than 1 day and I'm a casual coder)
= no strip planets, more building to do, protect planets and search for others mines, regulary things to do (after all !) un rendez-vous !. many more logical system to exploit auto this extraction... that's give many things with few lines (of codes)....

For Ideas who are quite complex (wth balance, codes etc..) but I don't write because it is effectively early :
Make planet exploding when core is not enough covered by earth (or ground blocks) as volcanoes... destructing all in sector or 4 around, Then you can make trap on planets by explosive in many parts, huge ship will avoid planets during battle in ennemies territories.. could give a big tactical effect...
don't talk about all balance, have to be long to prepare, with a "no salvage planet", etc...
That IS a early idea i keep for me ! lol

Based on Schine's stated plans and history of timeliness, I would expect less than a year, but not less than a few months. The game used to be focused on these band aid fixes as you suggest, but after a few years they kinda screwed themselves with unclear code and lack of direction and are now in the process of a much more clearly scheduled, major rebuild push that does not focus on playability as much as pushing the development cycle towards completeness.

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Specialize Planets : bunker, mining and others...

Salvage planets from space as asteroids :

Is a good point.

A nerf could be enough.

Should be replace by ground technic.

Should be allowed only manually.

Don't care about that, I wait for other do the job and steal them.

arkahys

Nosajimiki

MacThule

NuclearFun

MacThule

Sachys

Hermit.

arkahys

Nosajimiki