I voted... try to change my mind

Guard13007 · Apr 21, 2015

I noticed after submitting my votes that they could be changed afterwards. I'm also not 100% confident in my votes because I haven't been particularly active in the community. I based them off of my own ideas of what I think would be the most important qualities (based on the applications) and some of the info in the Q & A sessions posted here.

There's still a few days left, so I'm posting this in the hope of stirring up some kind of debate, ANY debate on why the people I chose may or may not be good choices.

Also sorry if I'm not supposed to say who I'm voting for, I couldn't find anything about that.

CyberTao
idiotplaysgames
Will2brown
Tomino_sama
Dalmont

(Note this list isn't in the preferential order I selected, simply the random order assigned by loading the voting page.)

Sooo, with that, CHANGE MY MIND.

Lancake · Apr 21, 2015

Consider voting for megacrafter127, he knows the game, community and is a friendly guy.

HerrColonel · Apr 21, 2015

I voted for lecic because veteran player and pvp tournament
I voted for none of the youtubers because they are overrepresented

lazarus78 · Apr 21, 2015

You voted for Tomino_sama, despite his warning history? A chat ban and 2 time flamer just days before the applications became viewable? Meaning that while applications were being discussed and submitted, he broke the rules, not once, but twice.

I don't see how in good conscious one could vote for someone who has a blatant disregard for the community rules. The council is supposed to represent us, and he is not a good role model. His whole application sounded more like an advertisement for his social media pages and youtube channel than anything.

Just saying.

Thalanor · Apr 21, 2015

The only thing most (including TS) starmade youtubers contribute to the game is mass-producing low-quality videos in order to appeal to the lowest common preteen denominator and boost their channel view counts in order to ultimately pave the way for youtube partnership.

They don't do this for selfless reasons (or god forbid, for the greater good of the community). It is their business model, and their viewers are their product.

CyberTao · Apr 21, 2015

The lack of Comr4de is disgraceful!

But seriously, he was a tester in the past and cares a lot about balance and multiplayer PvP. He's also shown to be able to take incentive, meaning he would be able to bring up the topics that most other council runners would not be able to (either because inexperience, or uncertainty in opinions). He may not exactly fit your criteria for vote, but he is well worth your vote anyways.

Also; does Dalmont even come to the forums? He is so sparsely present that I've forgotten he was running thrice now.

Tydeth · Apr 21, 2015

In no particular order, my choices (and why):

Comr4de: He's a long-time player, former official tester, and leader of the faction Arstozka Empire. He has knowledge of the game's development history, experience in communication with both Schine and players, and as Tao said he is versed in PVP and initiative.

Megacrafter: As a modder, he knows the game's code, and is proficient in the language Schema uses to make the game. This means he can give a software developer's perspective on prospective ideas and suggestions, including various methods to implement them and their pros/cons, the CPU/RAM cost of any particular idea and what that'd mean for servers, etc. He may likewise be of help finding ways to further optimize the main code.

Crusade: He also mods, but he touches the graphical stuff while Mega tackles code. In addition, he's also a moderator, so he also has experience with both community and Schine.

Keptick: His listed strength of converging multiple ideas concerning a topic will be a skill well-suited to the intended role of the council, to take input from the community and condense it for Schine's perusal.

SkylordLuke: One of Starmade's selling points is its creative potential, so having someone on the council who is well versed in that would be beneficial. He also brings the benefit of having the massive following on YouTube through MushroomFleet, granting easy access to a section of the community for the Council's two-way communication. Since the Council is supposed to collectively represent the entire community of StarMade players, it makes sense to have a YouTube/MF guy. Tomino got banned from the chat, so he can't communicate there, and I haven't seen Dalmont post much at all; Luke seemed the most behaved and active of the big three, making him the best candidate to represent that crowd imho.

EmperorVonDoom · Apr 21, 2015

lazarus78 said:
You voted for Tomino_sama, despite his warning history? A chat ban and 2 time flamer just days before the applications became viewable? Meaning that while applications were being discussed and submitted, he broke the rules, not once, but twice.

I don't see how in good conscious one could vote for someone who has a blatant disregard for the community rules. The council is supposed to represent us, and he is not a good role model. His whole application sounded more like an advertisement for his social media pages and youtube channel than anything.

Just saying.

I am going to stop you right there! That is in relation to a a bunch of trolls Flame Baiting Tomino on chat, the mods asked for them all to stop but Tomino was banned for defending himself, and he has done nothing but good for the StarMade community in promoting the game and getting new viewers to play StarMade.

Thalanor said:
The only thing most (including TS) starmade youtubers contribute to the game is mass-producing low-quality videos in order to appeal to the lowest common preteen denominator and boost their channel view counts in order to ultimately pave the way for youtube partnership.

They don't do this for selfless reasons (or god forbid, for the greater good of the community). It is their business model, and their viewers are their product.

No, What the StarMade YouTubers contribute the most is keeping everyone interested in playing the game, providing entertainment and keeping you all up to date on new in game features.

We all already had our YouTube partnerships two years ago, and we take our free time to make these videos which we don't have to do and to be honest in terms of making money, are not really worth doing, e.g. Minimum wage makes 10x more money and than what we do making on YouTube. We just do it as a hobby.
As for the quality, just looking at Tomino's videos, they are actually of good quality, same with SkylordLuke's and the rest of them.

#Don'tquityourdayjobitpaysmore in relation to how much money you guys seem to think we are making.

Guard13007, I added you onto the Mushroomfleet Docking Hub mate, a bit of selfless promotion for you.

I think Jath would be a good choice , he may not be as well known, but he is a good guy who knows his stuff.

Guard13007 has a YouTube for anyone interested in watching his content: https://www.youtube.com/user/guard13007

Comr4de · Apr 21, 2015

EmperorVonDoom said:
As for the quality, just looking at Tomino's videos, they are actually of good quality, same with SkylordLuke's and the rest of them.

I'll stop you right there because feedback has been given MULTIPLE times for tomino, and each time it has been given it has been ignored/flamed in turn. There is a general consensus that the polish and finish on tomino's videos is generally low. The visual style is a mess. Neon_42 had a pretty good outline on why they're bad from a production standpoint and I'll see if I can find it.

Furthermore, just because you're receiving personal attacks does not justify flaming. It says this in the rules. As someone who was in the chat room when tomino was banned, what few attacks had actually taken place ceased at that point, yet he continued to attack others. The mods asked him multiple times to stop and he didn't. He got banned. He was very clearly in violation of the rules, and had been warned to stop multiple times. The forum rules are very clear about flamebait not being an appropriate defense for flaming. Stop treating it like one. Being able to handle criticism/trolls/heat is going to be a big part of this council position. It's perfectly justified to have misgivings due to that.

You are clearly biased in this sense, just as I am. I'll try to find the exact quote.

Edit: The thread is here. If I recall correctly there was another version directed at tomino. I'm not able to find it but it's entirely possible the thread was deleted.

The part where tomino ignores and proceeds to ridicule OP for his feedback is located HERE.

I will say however that skylord's videos are generally well-polished at least.

Tydeth said:
SkylordLuke: One of Starmade's selling points is its creative potential, so having someone on the council who is well versed in that would be beneficial. He also brings the benefit of having the massive following on YouTube through MushroomFleet, granting easy access to a section of the community for the Council's two-way communication. Since the Council is supposed to collectively represent the entire community of StarMade players, it makes sense to have a YouTube/MF guy. Tomino got banned from the chat, so he can't communicate there, and I haven't seen Dalmont post much at all; Luke seemed the most behaved and active of the big three, making him the best candidate to represent that crowd imho.

So much of this. Out of all of the MF big three, Skylord is honestly the best choice.

My order:

Megacrafter
Keptick
MrFURB
Nauvran
TheRimmer96

CyberTao · Apr 21, 2015

EmperorVonDoom and Comr4de
DO NOT bring that argument here. It will end in a back and forth, and this isn't the place for it.

Every person is responsible for their own actions. Tomato as well as the other contenders were warned, and as such, were also protected by the active moderators at the time. To say that he was banned after being harassed (after both sides were openly warned) is the same as declaring moderator bias. If Tomato feels it was unjust, he could probably talk to Duke or someone about having it amended from record or something (still being listed, but striked out for example).

Lancake · Apr 21, 2015

I really, really hope council members will be able to lay aside their differences. You're going to work together so if it isn't going to work out between 2 or more members, the whole council will be a failure and you will be the ones to blame.

So please do not start a flame war on each other.

EmperorVonDoom · Apr 21, 2015

CyberTao said:
EmperorVonDoom and Comr4de
DO NOT bring that argument here. It will end in a back and forth, and this isn't the place for it.

Every person is responsible for their own actions. Tomato as well as the other contenders were warned, and as such, were also protected by the active moderators at the time. To say that he was banned after being harassed (after both sides were openly warned) is the same as declaring moderator bias. If Tomato feels it was unjust, he could probably talk to Duke or someone about having it amended from record or something (still being listed, but striked out for example).

Don't worry I have said my peace, This is all ill say.

Comr4de · Apr 21, 2015

CyberTao said:
EmperorVonDoom and Comr4de
DO NOT bring that argument here. It will end in a back and forth, and this isn't the place for it.

Good point, I've amended my post.

Megacrafter127 · Apr 21, 2015

Tydeth said:
In no particular order, my choices (and why):

Comr4de: He's a long-time player, former official tester, and leader of the faction Arstozka Empire. He has knowledge of the game's development history, experience in communication with both Schine and players, and as Tao said he is versed in PVP and initiative.

Megacrafter: As a modder, he knows the game's code, and is proficient in the language Schema uses to make the game. This means he can give a software developer's perspective on prospective ideas and suggestions, including various methods to implement them and their pros/cons, the CPU/RAM cost of any particular idea and what that'd mean for servers, etc. He may likewise be of help finding ways to further optimize the main code.

Crusade: He also mods, but he touches the graphical stuff while Mega tackles code. In addition, he's also a moderator, so he also has experience with both community and Schine.

Keptick: His listed strength of converging multiple ideas concerning a topic will be a skill well-suited to the intended role of the council, to take input from the community and condense it for Schine's perusal.

SkylordLuke: One of Starmade's selling points is its creative potential, so having someone on the council who is well versed in that would be beneficial. He also brings the benefit of having the massive following on YouTube through MushroomFleet, granting easy access to a section of the community for the Council's two-way communication. Since the Council is supposed to collectively represent the entire community of StarMade players, it makes sense to have a YouTube/MF guy. Tomino got banned from the chat, so he can't communicate there, and I haven't seen Dalmont post much at all; Luke seemed the most behaved and active of the big three, making him the best candidate to represent that crowd imho.

I like your reasoning, although I think I'll be eliminated pretty fast by only getting 2nd choices

Tomino_sama · Apr 21, 2015

I stay away from the forums nowadays, but I'm glad to clear up confusion regarding this:

Firstly I am responsible for my own actions, I am 32 and a father of two. Tomato was not protected by anyone or anything and receives no special treatment by anyone or anything. I called in the moderators due to the behavior in what is a public chat representing starmade to prospective players.

I do accuse moderator bias. I do feel it is unjust. I have spoken to Those tasked with this, both Moderators and Schine. I have had the ban lifted since. It is still on the application.

Anything else is private between me and others concerned.

However I do not talk about other candidates.
I believe you should vote for whoever you want and that is all.

all this playground politics where you try and tell lies about a running mate will only be counter productive once the council is formed.

Goodbye for now.

Nauvran · Apr 21, 2015

Comr4de said:
My order:

Megacrafter

Keptick

MrFURB

Nauvran

TheRimmer96

I did not expect to be on your list and especially not above our dear cake.

Guard13007 · Apr 21, 2015

So far, both the responses here and further attention to the applications and Q/A's has convinced me to change a few of my votes. I would like to thank you all for discussing this in a civil manner, and not turning this thread into a flame war (although it almost started to go that way haha).

lazarus78 said:
You voted for Tomino_sama, despite his warning history? A chat ban and 2 time flamer just days before the applications became viewable? Meaning that while applications were being discussed and submitted, he broke the rules, not once, but twice.

I don't see how in good conscious one could vote for someone who has a blatant disregard for the community rules. The council is supposed to represent us, and he is not a good role model. His whole application sounded more like an advertisement for his social media pages and youtube channel than anything.

Just saying.

I was not aware of this. I voted for him because he has consistently informed me of new things in StarMade, and appears to be a very active part of the community and bringing in new members. He also appears to be very well informed about the workings of StarMade (not necessarily the code, I don't know about that, but the things you can do in game). As far as I can tell, he has been a good member of the community with minor infractions. I don't know what happened between him and others, because I wasn't there. If you could show me, I am curious to see for myself, but it seems you're talking about things in chat / livestreams? Not in the forums? Is there a record?

Megacrafter127 · Apr 21, 2015

Guard13007 said:
Is there a record?

Apart from the list of all warnings dukebot posted below the applications, I think all violating forum posts are either erased or removed from public view.

CyberTao · Apr 21, 2015

Guard13007 said:
If you could show me, I am curious to see for myself, but it seems you're talking about things in chat / livestreams? Not in the forums? Is there a record?

Chat is part of the forums. As much as some people may protest, chat is where a lot of Dev (build) updates and changes are posted first, we also have a few testers that roam around, and even some of Schine hangs out there. There are many discussions that happen there that never really see a thread made, as point are raised and concluded, or people come to a common agreement. Chat is where you will find the most concerns; Weapon balance for example. Forums are also slower paced most of the time, making chat good for a quick check or feedback.

Tomato has had a small history on the forums. A couple threads of his has quickly devolved into a flame-fest and they were removed within a few days (Tomato never got points for them I think, but some of the other apps have points related to them I think). There is no way to view a full history, probably due to a NDA for mods that says they can't talk about it.

Megacrafter127 said:
I think all violating forum posts are either erased or removed from public view.

I think 9.8/10 of the time, posts are just moved into a private moderator forums, that way mods can review what happened later and such. Very few things are actually deleted, as deleted post can not be restored or reviewed later. To my knowledge anyways.

Megacrafter127 · Apr 21, 2015

CyberTao said:
I think 9.8/10 of the time, posts are just moved into a private moderator forums, that way mods can review what happened later and such. Very few things are actually deleted, as deleted post can not be restored or reviewed later. To my knowledge anyways.

An or still is an or, the statement is true even if only 1 of the substatements is true :P

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I voted... try to change my mind

Guard13007

Lancake

Head of Testing

HerrColonel

lazarus78

Thalanor

CEO Snataris Colonial Fleetyards

CyberTao

鬼佬

Tydeth

EmperorVonDoom

Comr4de

CyberTao

鬼佬

Lancake

Head of Testing

EmperorVonDoom

Comr4de

Megacrafter127

Tomino_sama

Nauvran

Cake Build Server Official Button Presser

Guard13007

Megacrafter127

CyberTao

鬼佬

Megacrafter127